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Ok thank you for the clarification.
Actually I do not think the debt is hgh for KIT, because the assets in the business are stable enough to support a high debt to asset ratio. Whether a certain level of debt is high depends of course on the underlying asset. I would agree a debt to asset ratio in the 40-50% range is high if the underlying asset was say a cryptocurrency - I am not sure I would be comfortable there using any debt at all. But with KIT' s assets? I know private investors that are leveraging wind farms like those that KIT has at 70%+ debt / asset ratios. KIT is unrated but I remember from a management call that they are basically leveraging KIT to investment grade levels somthing like BBB. That' s perfectly sensible and companies at this rating level never lose access to debt finance whatever the market conditons.
investshare ( Date: 27-Aug-2025 08:09) Posted:
First you did not disagree with the fact that the debt is high, but argue it is ok because it is at asset level.
My point is that if the higher level is simply the sum of assets and liabilities of the assets. Thus high debt is high debt, it does not get easier (that is what I mean that the asset carries risks). The only consolation is that the higher level has no obligation to repay for it.
Alignment ( Date: 26-Aug-2025 19:02) Posted:
Not sure what you mean in your second sentence - what is your point there?
For the avoidance of doubt, the logic behind my comment is that it is easy to refi asset level debt at these gearing levels. The fact they recently refied a perp at the holding company level supports this - the higher up the holding structure the more difficult a refi might be, so if they can refi the perp easily they will have no problem to refi the asset level debt |
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In other words, if the assets carrying high debt fail because of default, then KIT will be impacted negatively
investshare ( Date: 27-Aug-2025 08:09) Posted:
First you did not disagree with the fact that the debt is high, but argue it is ok because it is at asset level.
My point is that if the higher level is simply the sum of assets and liabilities of the assets. Thus high debt is high debt, it does not get easier (that is what I mean that the asset carries risks). The only consolation is that the higher level has no obligation to repay for it.
Alignment ( Date: 26-Aug-2025 19:02) Posted:
Not sure what you mean in your second sentence - what is your point there?
For the avoidance of doubt, the logic behind my comment is that it is easy to refi asset level debt at these gearing levels. The fact they recently refied a perp at the holding company level supports this - the higher up the holding structure the more difficult a refi might be, so if they can refi the perp easily they will have no problem to refi the asset level debt |
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First you did not disagree with the fact that the debt is high, but argue it is ok because it is at asset level.
My point is that if the higher level is simply the sum of assets and liabilities of the assets. Thus high debt is high debt, it does not get easier (that is what I mean that the asset carries risks). The only consolation is that the higher level has no obligation to repay for it.
Alignment ( Date: 26-Aug-2025 19:02) Posted:
Not sure what you mean in your second sentence - what is your point there?
For the avoidance of doubt, the logic behind my comment is that it is easy to refi asset level debt at these gearing levels. The fact they recently refied a perp at the holding company level supports this - the higher up the holding structure the more difficult a refi might be, so if they can refi the perp easily they will have no problem to refi the asset level debt.
investshare ( Date: 26-Aug-2025 08:02) Posted:
True that it is at asset level.
But this also mean the asset are riskier than what they want us to believe |
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Not sure what you mean in your second sentence - what is your point there?
For the avoidance of doubt, the logic behind my comment is that it is easy to refi asset level debt at these gearing levels. The fact they recently refied a perp at the holding company level supports this - the higher up the holding structure the more difficult a refi might be, so if they can refi the perp easily they will have no problem to refi the asset level debt.
investshare ( Date: 26-Aug-2025 08:02) Posted:
True that it is at asset level.
But this also mean the asset are riskier than what they want us to believe.
Alignment ( Date: 19-Aug-2025 11:42) Posted:
| You can see from the slide its almost all at the asset level. It will be easy for them to ref |
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True that it is at asset level.
But this also mean the asset are riskier than what they want us to believe.
Alignment ( Date: 19-Aug-2025 11:42) Posted:
You can see from the slide its almost all at the asset level. It will be easy for them to refi
jackass ( Date: 16-Aug-2025 17:10) Posted:
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Slowly to 53.5 cents
Slowly recovering back to 47cts next 12 months
Lightyear ( Date: 25-Aug-2025 22:02) Posted:
| Good run.
Wasted never average when it was 0.38 |
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Good run.
Wasted never average when it was 0.38
KIT' s biggest problem is that their management fees skyrocketed but they are not delivering when it comes to finding deals.
Every year, there' s only a few deals and deal size is a mere 1% of AUM. Not sure what their investment team is doing all day.
You can see from the slide its almost all at the asset level. It will be easy for them to refi
jackass ( Date: 16-Aug-2025 17:10) Posted:
Be careful of the ~900 million debt repayment in 2026 ... it seems like a massive rights issue exercise
Refer to KIT slides page 24
https://links.sgx.com/1.0.0/corporate-announcements/591M5VNXBYNC2F7V/855336_KIT%20Investor%20Presentation%20-%20August%202025.pdf
Alignment ( Date: 15-Aug-2025 10:23) Posted:
An investor that bought at the start of 2021 at 54.5c would by now have received 22c of dividend. Adding the residual current share price of 42c that totals 64c representing a return of 16.5% over 4 years. Not great but could be worse.
Personally my return has been much higher than this because the share has been relatively volatile for a company that is so stable, allowing me to often trade in and out buying low and selling high. There have also been discounted placements which have facilitated this as well. All of which also involves luck. I think I have made about 10% a year compounded on this i.e around 50% up overall during the same period. |
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Be careful of the ~900 million debt repayment in 2026 ... it seems like a massive rights issue exercise
Refer to KIT slides page 24
https://links.sgx.com/1.0.0/corporate-announcements/591M5VNXBYNC2F7V/855336_KIT%20Investor%20Presentation%20-%20August%202025.pdfAlignment ( Date: 15-Aug-2025 10:23) Posted:
An investor that bought at the start of 2021 at 54.5c would by now have received 22c of dividend. Adding the residual current share price of 42c that totals 64c representing a return of 16.5% over 4 years. Not great but could be worse.
Personally my return has been much higher than this because the share has been relatively volatile for a company that is so stable, allowing me to often trade in and out buying low and selling high. There have also been discounted placements which have facilitated this as well. All of which also involves luck. I think I have made about 10% a year compounded on this i.e around 50% up overall during the same period. |
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An investor that bought at the start of 2021 at 54.5c would by now have received 22c of dividend. Adding the residual current share price of 42c that totals 64c representing a return of 16.5% over 4 years. Not great but could be worse.
Personally my return has been much higher than this because the share has been relatively volatile for a company that is so stable, allowing me to often trade in and out buying low and selling high. There have also been discounted placements which have facilitated this as well. All of which also involves luck. I think I have made about 10% a year compounded on this i.e around 50% up overall during the same period.
How much have you lost in value of your original investment?
stlimst ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 21:56) Posted:
Good to reinvest for compound growth.
As for me, I have always treated the dividend as passive income - so no reinvetsment.
Can last me 6 months of grocery buying.
MrBear12 ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 19:15) Posted:
| Time to reinvest it for compound growt |
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Good to reinvest for compound growth.
As for me, I have always treated the dividend as passive income - so no reinvetsment.
Can last me 6 months of grocery buying.
MrBear12 ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 19:15) Posted:
Time to reinvest it for compound growth
SDEXXXXD ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 17:43) Posted:
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Time to reinvest it for compound growth
SDEXXXXD ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 17:43) Posted:
KIT angpow is IN...:)
MrBear12 ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:18) Posted:
Bear is glad he is not alone
trade with fellow travelers on the same road
happy collecting our dividend today!
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KIT angpow is IN...:)
MrBear12 ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:18) Posted:
Bear is glad he is not alone
trade with fellow travelers on the same road
happy collecting our dividend today!
stlimst ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:08) Posted:
I am one of them. |
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I think you can say eaxctly the same for KIT! :)
Share price tumbled too.
Not sure about better track record.
60% of Utd Hamspshire' s tenats are essentials.. even through Covid, they were there.
MrBear12 ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:58) Posted:
Prophet, because it lost a lot of money at the start and the share price tumbled some 50 per cent, as I wrote some time back.
I'm neutral now. But only because of expected interest cuts.
However shld interest rates go up again, this spells trouble.
Bear generally avoids counters so sensitive to US interest rates.
Such counters require in depth knowledge of the local market and good timing to make anything.
I'd rather retire happily than worry about markets, so I pick kit with a similar yield. KiTs got a better track record.
prophetjul ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:26) Posted:
Bear
Why are you negative on Utd Hampshire?
Dividends of 9%. |
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Prophet, because it lost a lot of money at the start and the share price tumbled some 50 per cent, as I wrote some time back.
I'm neutral now. But only because of expected interest cuts.
However shld interest rates go up again, this spells trouble.
Bear generally avoids counters so sensitive to US interest rates.
Such counters require in depth knowledge of the local market and good timing to make anything.
I'd rather retire happily than worry about markets, so I pick kit with a similar yield. KiTs got a better track record.
prophetjul ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:26) Posted:
Bear
Why are you negative on Utd Hampshire?
Dividends of 9%.
MrBear12 ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:18) Posted:
Bear is glad he is not alone
trade with fellow travelers on the same road
happy collecting our dividend today!
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Me look forward to collect the angpow from KIT this evening
MrBear12 ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:18) Posted:
Bear is glad he is not alone
trade with fellow travelers on the same road
happy collecting our dividend today!
stlimst ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:08) Posted:
| I am one of them. |
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Bear
Why are you negative on Utd Hampshire?
Dividends of 9%.
MrBear12 ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:18) Posted:
Bear is glad he is not alone
trade with fellow travelers on the same road
happy collecting our dividend today!
stlimst ( Date: 13-Aug-2025 08:08) Posted:
| I am one of them. |
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