YZJ Fin Hldg    Last:0.225   -

YZJFH - potentially rewarding

外 媒 的 一 项 最 新 调 查 显 示 ， 全 球 顶 级 基 金 经 理 大 多 看 好 2023年 的 中 国 股 市 ， 预 计 随 着 中 国 疫 情 防 控 措 施 进 一 步 优 化 ， 股 市 可 能 会 持 续 上 涨 。 Keep for your future, must keep dont sell

 

The shares were from converting a government entity to current public company.   And they continue to hold them as these are GLCs of critical national infrastructure. 

Says nothing about the investing acument of Temasek and GIC. 

Know your history else you sound really dumb. 

pasttime      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 20:32) Posted: people all over the place keep hammer temasek for losses on ftx. but anyone who is in crypto will know that ftx when it is ok is like a very credible exchange.  but really temasek exposure is also not big. number is big to us becuase most thing with temasek is big. for example dividend. temasek owns 8677999863 shares of singtel. current calender year temasek received $0.119 dividend per share. ie they received 1b+ in dividend.  so the talk about 1 ftx lost so many millions  is more then covered by the dividend received from 1 stock. not to mentioned dividend from other stock. also the current controlling  management is going asset light type of investment, like what we see in capitaland group. these create a lot of meat for temasek, the market also like the listed company less the meat. company of their size holds a lot of asset and received a lot of money even if they just employ a clerk to manage it. tm employ top of the cream and pay top $ for these people. i think they have also deliver in many many other investment. don' t just look at failed event. look at alibaba, boc etc all these has return more then 1x profit. i ahve respect for temasek and gic people. jsut that these are a bit expensive. hope they deliver more then their cost.

 

That' s proper minimum due diligence when you investing hundreds of $m.

Of cos, you deluded people here won' t know much about such basic risk management. 

' That' s also why you don' t think it' s a big issue when FH reported over $750m of NPL   Was there a warning from last quarterly report?   No.

So either FH chose to hide the issue or their risk control is so bad, they didn' t know. Either way, it shows that it' s a junk company. 

GoldenPig      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 23:55) Posted: Wow! You mean you actually write to each company when you plan to buy its shares and ask them to first show proof they have a proper accounting department? Hats off to you. GoodLearner      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 22:57) Posted: https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/ftx-bankruptcy-alameda-research-no-accounting-department-sam-bankman-fried-2022-11 I would never put my fund in a company without any accounting department

 

It the market makers that selling down through shorting with borrowed stock. Time span is unlimited as long they can keep up paying the investors who loan them stock. But again when it time to return stock, there Gona be big rush to buy in. Market makers usually in market to correctly price stock with respect to future risk. When they feel YZJFH done enough, they would restore YZJFH to proper valuation.
interest rate globally for all kind of financial products going up massively in 2023 due to higher fed rate.
It a miracle global markets did not crash in Oct2023 and everyone eat dirt.
$730+m real estate DI most likely be rolled over with higher renewed interest rate, with china bank providing liquidity real estate no problem in keeping up with debt interest payment over next few years. Enjoy the dividend from china banks for a few years.
Anyway DI would be reduced to 30% in 2023, freeing up another$1+b cash to be transfer to sg.

soeteono      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 16:20) Posted: Because the SBB could not absorb those who wanted to get out , maybe more than 19 % wants to get out ? tch77_pt75      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 15:13) Posted: I agree. The Eastern fund manager needs to learn from Western fund manager. The sell down force is too strong for Ren and his management team despite SBB. It has been a downward trend since launched, which is beyond what Ren and his management team capability

 

Wow! You mean you actually write to each company when you plan to buy its shares and ask them to first show proof they have a proper accounting department? Hats off to you.

GoodLearner      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 22:57) Posted: https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/ftx-bankruptcy-alameda-research-no-accounting-department-sam-bankman-fried-2022-11 I would never put my fund in a company without any accounting department

 

https://markets.businessinsider.com/news/currencies/ftx-bankruptcy-alameda-research-no-accounting-department-sam-bankman-fried-2022-11
I would never put my fund in a company without any accounting department

 

Agree. If any fund manager claims it has never lost money on any investment, I will run far away from it.
It is the overall portfolio returns in the long term that matters. So how fundmanagers assess and limit risk of each investment to the overall portfolio is important. The FTX loss is big to retail investors, but it is a tiny percentage of the Temasek portfolio.

pasttime      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 20:32) Posted: people all over the place keep hammer temasek for losses on ftx. but anyone who is in crypto will know that ftx when it is ok is like a very credible exchange.  but really temasek exposure is also not big. number is big to us becuase most thing with temasek is big. for example dividend. temasek owns 8677999863 shares of singtel. current calender year temasek received $0.119 dividend per share. ie they received 1b+ in dividend.  so the talk about 1 ftx lost so many millions  is more then covered by the dividend received from 1 stock. not to mentioned dividend from other stock. also the current controlling  management is going asset light type of investment, like what we see in capitaland group. these create a lot of meat for temasek, the market also like the listed company less the meat. company of their size holds a lot of asset and received a lot of money even if they just employ a clerk to manage it. tm employ top of the cream and pay top $ for these people. i think they have also deliver in many many other investment. don' t just look at failed event. look at alibaba, boc etc all these has return more then 1x profit. i ahve respect for temasek and gic people. jsut that these are a bit expensive. hope they deliver more then their cost.

 

people all over the place keep hammer temasek for losses on ftx. but anyone who is in crypto will know that ftx when it is ok is like a very credible exchange.  but really temasek exposure is also not big. number is big to us becuase most thing with temasek is big.
for example dividend. temasek owns 8677999863 shares of singtel. current calender year temasek received $0.119 dividend per share. ie they received 1b+ in dividend.  so the talk about 1 ftx lost so many millions  is more then covered by the dividend received from 1 stock. not to mentioned dividend from other stock. also the current controlling  management is going asset light type of investment, like what we see in capitaland group. these create a lot of meat for temasek, the market also like the listed company less the meat.
company of their size holds a lot of asset and received a lot of money even if they just employ a clerk to manage it. tm employ top of the cream and pay top $ for these people. i think they have also deliver in many many other investment. don' t just look at failed event. look at alibaba, boc etc all these has return more then 1x profit.
i ahve respect for temasek and gic people. jsut that these are a bit expensive. hope they deliver more then their cost.

 

Let the share price tell the story. As of to-date, the share price which is a gauge of company potential in the future is bleak? lol

tpohwashere      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 19:32) Posted: ROFL!!! Hey Volvo, now you are wondering why FH can hold it' s price at 33 cents? May I remind you of your " pump it to the sky message" ..... " YFH value = 1.08 + 3.7 = $4.78 per share" You have so much confidence in all the big names.   Err ... Temasek and GIC are filled with all the big names and yet burnt over $200m on FTX?   There' s a whole list of failures before FTX. Point is - don' t get deluded by brand names.   I know personally a lot of " senior investment advisers" in GIC, all semi-retired with decades of experience .... and a lot of them are clueless.   volvo125      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 01:16) Posted: I believe the key reason why YFH can still hold its price at ~0.33 inspite of the abrupt sharp increase of NPL to 30% and also in the absence of SBB is due to its CASH value. Cash & Yield products has been quoted as 27.6% of YFH Total portfolio. Note, it is Total Portfolio (AUM) at $4323m, not Nav at $4089m. Yield products are almost Cash equivalent, so the Total Cash and Cash equivalent in YFH balance sheet at 27.6% can be translated to $1193m, which at the latest 3691m o/s, is valued at 0.323 per share.  The 30% NPL is YFH own asset so even if in the super worst doomsday scenario where the entire $762m ought to be written off and all the collaterals are also somehow worthless, YFH Net Asset and AUM will delcine by $762m accordingly, which will certainly affect its future income streams, and in turn its valuation (which is not relevant because YFH is already heavily discounted from its intrinsic value),  BUT the Cash in the balance sheet will still remain intact as $1193m. Somehow, the market (the Big Boys) have " conspired" to discount YFH to just its Cash Value, ignoring all its other income generating assets for god knows the reasons. Now, some people may still go on to question is this $1193m REAL ?  The Audit and Risk Committee team is headed by Chua (Ex Snr Dir MAS), with Chew (Ex Snr Managing Dir SGX), and Yee (Chairman of a Law firm). These men are high profile veterans with strong reputations in the financial regulatory, asset management and legal sectors. So unless you are questioning the integrity, morale bearing, intellectual ability and the combined wealth of experiences of these 3 men, there is really no need to question the authenticity of the financial statement or this $1193m Cash holding. And in case IF you still do, then you should really sell away the stock and move on to one that you think you can trust its financials.

 

ROFL!!!

Hey Volvo, now you are wondering why FH can hold it' s price at 33 cents?

May I remind you of your " pump it to the sky message" .....

" YFH value = 1.08 + 3.7 = $4.78 per share"

You have so much confidence in all the big names.   Err ... Temasek and GIC are filled with all the big names and yet burnt over $200m on FTX?   There' s a whole list of failures before FTX.

Point is - don' t get deluded by brand names.   I know personally a lot of " senior investment advisers" in GIC, all semi-retired with decades of experience .... and a lot of them are clueless.


 

volvo125      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 01:16) Posted: I believe the key reason why YFH can still hold its price at ~0.33 inspite of the abrupt sharp increase of NPL to 30% and also in the absence of SBB is due to its CASH value. Cash & Yield products has been quoted as 27.6% of YFH Total portfolio. Note, it is Total Portfolio (AUM) at $4323m, not Nav at $4089m. Yield products are almost Cash equivalent, so the Total Cash and Cash equivalent in YFH balance sheet at 27.6% can be translated to $1193m, which at the latest 3691m o/s, is valued at 0.323 per share.  The 30% NPL is YFH own asset so even if in the super worst doomsday scenario where the entire $762m ought to be written off and all the collaterals are also somehow worthless, YFH Net Asset and AUM will delcine by $762m accordingly, which will certainly affect its future income streams, and in turn its valuation (which is not relevant because YFH is already heavily discounted from its intrinsic value),  BUT the Cash in the balance sheet will still remain intact as $1193m. Somehow, the market (the Big Boys) have " conspired" to discount YFH to just its Cash Value, ignoring all its other income generating assets for god knows the reasons. Now, some people may still go on to question is this $1193m REAL ?  The Audit and Risk Committee team is headed by Chua (Ex Snr Dir MAS), with Chew (Ex Snr Managing Dir SGX), and Yee (Chairman of a Law firm). These men are high profile veterans with strong reputations in the financial regulatory, asset management and legal sectors. So unless you are questioning the integrity, morale bearing, intellectual ability and the combined wealth of experiences of these 3 men, there is really no need to question the authenticity of the financial statement or this $1193m Cash holding. And in case IF you still do, then you should really sell away the stock and move on to one that you think you can trust its financials.

 

If we believe that YZJFH can establish itself and reach its target returns of 8-10% of NAV, if not in the first 3 years, then in the first 5 years, the dividend yield in 3-5 years will be at least 10% based on current share price of ~0.33. The share price by then may be 2-3 times of current price. Even if the share price is still suppressed at that time, investors who buy in now will be enjoying 10+% dividend yield based on current price. They are unlikely to sell and slaughter the goose that lays golden eggs every year.

This is my experience with Venture and UMS. They are now giving me 10+% dividend yields based on my entry prices and their share prices now during this bear market are 2.5 times of my initial investments. I expect the dividend yields on historical costs to keep increasing. My only regret is not buying more of them during the years when their prices were still depressed. 

I believe YZJFH will be another Venture or UMS for me. The currently depressed price is a window of opportunity to accumulate. I just added a batch at 0.335 a few days ago. I will not be unhappy if prices drop further and hit new lows. My average holding cost is already at a big discount to NAV and gives a nice low base for future dividend yields. New price lows will allow me to add and further reduce my average cost.

volvo125      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 01:16) Posted: I believe the key reason why YFH can still hold its price at ~0.33 inspite of the abrupt sharp increase of NPL to 30% and also in the absence of SBB is due to its CASH value. Cash & Yield products has been quoted as 27.6% of YFH Total portfolio. Note, it is Total Portfolio (AUM) at $4323m, not Nav at $4089m. Yield products are almost Cash equivalent, so the Total Cash and Cash equivalent in YFH balance sheet at 27.6% can be translated to $1193m, which at the latest 3691m o/s, is valued at 0.323 per share.  The 30% NPL is YFH own asset so even if in the super worst doomsday scenario where the entire $762m ought to be written off and all the collaterals are also somehow worthless, YFH Net Asset and AUM will delcine by $762m accordingly, which will certainly affect its future income streams, and in turn its valuation (which is not relevant because YFH is already heavily discounted from its intrinsic value),  BUT the Cash in the balance sheet will still remain intact as $1193m. Somehow, the market (the Big Boys) have " conspired" to discount YFH to just its Cash Value, ignoring all its other income generating assets for god knows the reasons. Now, some people may still go on to question is this $1193m REAL ?  The Audit and Risk Committee team is headed by Chua (Ex Snr Dir MAS), with Chew (Ex Snr Managing Dir SGX), and Yee (Chairman of a Law firm). These men are high profile veterans with strong reputations in the financial regulatory, asset management and legal sectors. So unless you are questioning the integrity, morale bearing, intellectual ability and the combined wealth of experiences of these 3 men, there is really no need to question the authenticity of the financial statement or this $1193m Cash holding. And in case IF you still do, then you should really sell away the stock and move on to one that you think you can trust its financials.

 

Because the SBB could not absorb those who wanted to get out , maybe more than 19 % wants to get out ?

tch77_pt75      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 15:13) Posted: I agree. The Eastern fund manager needs to learn from Western fund manager. The sell down force is too strong for Ren and his management team despite SBB. It has been a downward trend since launched, which is beyond what Ren and his management team capability. sgng123      ( Date: 09-Dec-2022 09:34) Posted: Hopefully they restart SSB soon or still got news coming later. Guessing the next news to drop would be the cancellation of treasury stock, most likely would help stock to rebound as it point strongly to second SSB in 2023 and all financial ratio get artificially boosted on lesser stocks. That how dow bull market for 10years lol, SSB and stock cancellation dilute retail and strengthen owner. YZJFH SSB fail to stabilise stock as it did not get cancel. Spending 99mil to buy back 6.6% and share price cut in half lol. China businessmen need to learn from an moh how to play global market.

 

Just cancel the treasury stocks and market would adjust. Chinese businessmen akway had cheap skate mentality, alway wanna buy cheap. SSB should be alway buy at seller price and ckean out them not trying to bid low at buyer q American bussiness very smart they buy in dove and destroy ant short selling q lol, don care buy everything meta lol.

 

I agree. The Eastern fund manager needs to learn from Western fund manager. The sell down force is too strong for Ren and his management team despite SBB. It has been a downward trend since launched, which is beyond what Ren and his management team capability.

sgng123      ( Date: 09-Dec-2022 09:34) Posted: Hopefully they restart SSB soon or still got news coming later. Guessing the next news to drop would be the cancellation of treasury stock, most likely would help stock to rebound as it point strongly to second SSB in 2023 and all financial ratio get artificially boosted on lesser stocks. That how dow bull market for 10years lol, SSB and stock cancellation dilute retail and strengthen owner. YZJFH SSB fail to stabilise stock as it did not get cancel. Spending 99mil to buy back 6.6% and share price cut in half lol. China businessmen need to learn from an moh how to play global market.

 

Update is out, China is calibrating Covid policy. Let Mr Market do the adjustment. 

 

Agree. Price has been stabilised. Cash value is around 50. ( Low 30, high 70). Be patient if want to hold.

volvo125      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 01:16) Posted: I believe the key reason why YFH can still hold its price at ~0.33 inspite of the abrupt sharp increase of NPL to 30% and also in the absence of SBB is due to its CASH value. Cash & Yield products has been quoted as 27.6% of YFH Total portfolio. Note, it is Total Portfolio (AUM) at $4323m, not Nav at $4089m. Yield products are almost Cash equivalent, so the Total Cash and Cash equivalent in YFH balance sheet at 27.6% can be translated to $1193m, which at the latest 3691m o/s, is valued at 0.323 per share.  The 30% NPL is YFH own asset so even if in the super worst doomsday scenario where the entire $762m ought to be written off and all the collaterals are also somehow worthless, YFH Net Asset and AUM will delcine by $762m accordingly, which will certainly affect its future income streams, and in turn its valuation (which is not relevant because YFH is already heavily discounted from its intrinsic value),  BUT the Cash in the balance sheet will still remain intact as $1193m. Somehow, the market (the Big Boys) have " conspired" to discount YFH to just its Cash Value, ignoring all its other income generating assets for god knows the reasons. Now, some people may still go on to question is this $1193m REAL ?  The Audit and Risk Committee team is headed by Chua (Ex Snr Dir MAS), with Chew (Ex Snr Managing Dir SGX), and Yee (Chairman of a Law firm). These men are high profile veterans with strong reputations in the financial regulatory, asset management and legal sectors. So unless you are questioning the integrity, morale bearing, intellectual ability and the combined wealth of experiences of these 3 men, there is really no need to question the authenticity of the financial statement or this $1193m Cash holding. And in case IF you still do, then you should really sell away the stock and move on to one that you think you can trust its financials.

 

Can only wait for big buyers to return

 

TH will be scoping anytime, low price low risk high return are all in favour for TH to invest big time.

DYODD

 

Agree, SBB can't do much. We need strong business results and FAT dividend to attract investors in.

volvo125      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 01:21) Posted: Yes ... you are right. SBB will enhance the Nav of the share BUT it is still Mr Market (or the Big Boys) that collectively and ultimately decide the price should go up or otherwise ...  Panda8      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 00:52) Posted: SBB don' t help to push up the price. This happen to many counters.  For those who get the shares through spin off, I noticed some of them sold SB and convert to FH. They  may think that with lower values the return is higher in percentage. But some time it is not the case. Low can be lower (FH), high can be higher (SB) depending on what they want to push.

 

Yes ... you are right. SBB will enhance the Nav of the share BUT it is still Mr Market (or the Big Boys) that collectively and ultimately decide the price should go up or otherwise ... 

Panda8      ( Date: 11-Dec-2022 00:52) Posted: SBB don' t help to push up the price. This happen to many counters.  For those who get the shares through spin off, I noticed some of them sold SB and convert to FH. They  may think that with lower values the return is higher in percentage. But some time it is not the case. Low can be lower (FH), high can be higher (SB) depending on what they want to push.