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des_khor Supreme	11-Nov-2021 17:51        des_khor About Contact  Quote this Post! Style: Flexible   Mood: Yells: "Tell me who is God or Market Fortune Teller in this forum ??"
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Business as usual if Hyflux just stay with water business .. who ask the company so greedy venture to power ... she doesn?t know meh ? How can Fire and water live harmony ? Wordee      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 17:21) Posted: it' s the case of people thinking that this Hyflux dealing with water resource, so the logic is it must be very stable and will never go wrong, like a member said it was a case of lose-lose bad investment from Hyflux into the Tuas spring desalination project des_khor      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 17:07) Posted: Now all get zero .. the CEO must accountable for reject previous offer at least can get back some ...
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bystander1965 Supreme	11-Nov-2021 17:31        bystander1965 About Contact  Quote this Post!   Mood: Yells: "What I say is just my assessment. DYODD"
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	That' s why must do our own homework. Cannot just buy and put in the freezer and forget. Ah gong in it or not doesn' t matter. He will not tell you when he runs away but you can always check. Ah gong in it may not be that good for small SH also. When he rescues, he will suck SH dry cause it' s his own interest that is more important. (Recent case? SCM. :p wtice in 1 year).   Wordee      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 17:21) Posted: it' s the case of people thinking that this Hyflux dealing with water resource, so the logic is it must be very stable and will never go wrong, like a member said it was a case of lose-lose bad investment from Hyflux into the Tuas spring desalination project des_khor      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 17:07) Posted: Now all get zero .. the CEO must accountable for reject previous offer at least can get back some ...
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Wordee Senior	11-Nov-2021 17:21        Wordee About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	it' s the case of people thinking that this Hyflux dealing with water resource, so the logic is it must be very stable and will never go wrong, like a member said it was a case of lose-lose bad investment from Hyflux into the Tuas spring desalination project des_khor      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 17:07) Posted: Now all get zero .. the CEO must accountable for reject previous offer at least can get back some ...
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des_khor Supreme	11-Nov-2021 17:07        des_khor About Contact  Quote this Post! Style: Flexible   Mood: Yells: "Tell me who is God or Market Fortune Teller in this forum ??"
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Now all get zero .. the CEO must accountable for reject previous offer at least can get back some ...
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whisng Veteran	11-Nov-2021 16:48        whisng About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Also that time when Hyflux were bleeding money, they still issue 6% bonds and some investors saw it as a good deal and ganna conned into it.  This Hyflux CEO should be investigated for fraud sia. marketuncle      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 16:14) Posted: Whoever is shareholder shouldn' t be a consideration for investment. Portfolio investors like Temasek, even if they do hold on to Hyflux until its last breath, doesn' t make a prince out of a toad. They make many bets, so long most turn out ok will do. Retail shareholders who only make a few bets that turn out to be toads have only themselves to blame if they didn' t do enough homework or diversification. Btw, for Hyflux, the last bet that sunk them was when they use the tuaspring project to use lucrative power tariff to subsidise water tariff, so that they can undercut the water market. Unfortunately, power became over supplied and no one made money. So lose-lose for Hyflux. whisng      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 14:10) Posted: Hyflux had been going south for years and also Temasek already exited it long ago and no one knows.  It is totally different from CLCT where Capitaland is the sponsor and Temasek is the major shareholder.  Unless Temasek exited CLCT, then we will know CLCT is in trouble, but I highly doubt so, cause CLCT is a rare gem which gives consistent dividends and recently those assets that they bought were industrial buildings which were proven to be resilient in the pandemic. Another major difference is that hyflux is only one company with limited assets whereas CLCT is a REIT with many asset types and a strong sponsor
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marketuncle Veteran	11-Nov-2021 16:14        marketuncle About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Whoever is shareholder shouldn' t be a consideration for investment. Portfolio investors like Temasek, even if they do hold on to Hyflux until its last breath, doesn' t make a prince out of a toad. They make many bets, so long most turn out ok will do. Retail shareholders who only make a few bets that turn out to be toads have only themselves to blame if they didn' t do enough homework or diversification. Btw, for Hyflux, the last bet that sunk them was when they use the tuaspring project to use lucrative power tariff to subsidise water tariff, so that they can undercut the water market. Unfortunately, power became over supplied and no one made money. So lose-lose for Hyflux. whisng      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 14:10) Posted: Hyflux had been going south for years and also Temasek already exited it long ago and no one knows.  It is totally different from CLCT where Capitaland is the sponsor and Temasek is the major shareholder.  Unless Temasek exited CLCT, then we will know CLCT is in trouble, but I highly doubt so, cause CLCT is a rare gem which gives consistent dividends and recently those assets that they bought were industrial buildings which were proven to be resilient in the pandemic. Another major difference is that hyflux is only one company with limited assets whereas CLCT is a REIT with many asset types and a strong sponsor. Wordee      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 12:28) Posted: hard to say lah..caution that nowadays anything can go bankrupt, rmber Hyflux? retirees sink their hard earned cpf money into Hyflux then in the end....GONE...
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marketuncle Veteran	11-Nov-2021 16:06        marketuncle About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	I buy and continue to hold because I did my own forecast and hence quite confident of the property income and corresponding distribution. If payout go south, it won' t be in deep shit. I will ... > _< .. lol.  Wordee      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 13:40) Posted: To see this counter move back to 1.4~ level will be long shot, hope it can maintain its div payout, if once div payout goes way down then it will be in deep sh...
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arctician1982 Senior	11-Nov-2021 15:00        arctician1982 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	yea 21% is direct from temasek only, i assume there are indirect stakes through its affliliates Capland etc. For some companies the plants, machinery, airplanes etc may not be able to realize their NAV because in a depressed scenario, buyers wont pay marked to market. For CLCT most of the assets are malls and building or real estate estates, so you wont see the asset value vaporize overnight and its value tend to remain intact.  Thats why personally i allocate more to reits because i believe in real estate vs a business where its assets are in plants, machinery etc.
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whisng Veteran	11-Nov-2021 14:13        whisng About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	SGX website put temasek holds 30.2339% not 21%....maybe is thru Temasek' s subsidaries and solely Temasek is 21% and plus others equal to 30.2339% arctician1982      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 13:47) Posted: if one look at financial, 44% of earnings are paid out as dividends and rest are retained. so there is still buffer to increase dividend payout ratio.  Key risk to me are successful transformation into logistics, datacentre beyond retail, strategy is good but unsure of successful execution which in turn sustain earnings growth and DPU. 2nd will be the high debt to equity ratio, at 60%+ its considered quite high to me i bought it purely because of temasek which owns 21% of it, i think 9CI caplandinvest has stake too
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whisng Veteran	11-Nov-2021 14:10        whisng About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Hyflux had been going south for years and also Temasek already exited it long ago and no one knows.  It is totally different from CLCT where Capitaland is the sponsor and Temasek is the major shareholder.  Unless Temasek exited CLCT, then we will know CLCT is in trouble, but I highly doubt so, cause CLCT is a rare gem which gives consistent dividends and recently those assets that they bought were industrial buildings which were proven to be resilient in the pandemic. Another major difference is that hyflux is only one company with limited assets whereas CLCT is a REIT with many asset types and a strong sponsor. Wordee      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 12:28) Posted: hard to say lah..caution that nowadays anything can go bankrupt, rmber Hyflux? retirees sink their hard earned cpf money into Hyflux then in the end....GONE...
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bystander1965 Supreme	11-Nov-2021 14:06        bystander1965 About Contact  Quote this Post!   Mood: Yells: "What I say is just my assessment. DYODD"
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Ya ya. Don' t just spew words. Anyone can do that. Show some data. If this if that. Everybody knows how to write those things.   Wordee      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 13:40) Posted: To see this counter move back to 1.4~ level will be long shot, hope it can maintain its div payout, if once div payout goes way down then it will be in deep sh...
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arctician1982 Senior	11-Nov-2021 13:47        arctician1982 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	if one look at financial, 44% of earnings are paid out as dividends and rest are retained. so there is still buffer to increase dividend payout ratio.  Key risk to me are successful transformation into logistics, datacentre beyond retail, strategy is good but unsure of successful execution which in turn sustain earnings growth and DPU. 2nd will be the high debt to equity ratio, at 60%+ its considered quite high to me i bought it purely because of temasek which owns 21% of it, i think 9CI caplandinvest has stake too
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Wordee Senior	11-Nov-2021 13:40        Wordee About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	To see this counter move back to 1.4~ level will be long shot, hope it can maintain its div payout, if once div payout goes way down then it will be in deep sh...
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arctician1982 Senior	11-Nov-2021 13:07        arctician1982 About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	just bought more 1.18, will just slowly and progressively average down, everytime 10 lots i find it quite ok
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bystander1965 Supreme	11-Nov-2021 13:06        bystander1965 About Contact  Quote this Post!   Mood: Yells: "What I say is just my assessment. DYODD"
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Exactly. The saying that got stuck with me is it's your money and if you are not interested to manage it, no one will. marketuncle      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 12:56) Posted: There are many cases of firms go belly up, hyflux, eagle trust (still liquidating)... the similarity is DYODD cannot be outsourced.
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marketuncle Veteran	11-Nov-2021 12:56        marketuncle About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	There are many cases of firms go belly up, hyflux, eagle trust (still liquidating)... the similarity is DYODD cannot be outsourced.
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bystander1965 Supreme	11-Nov-2021 12:35        bystander1965 About Contact  Quote this Post!   Mood: Yells: "What I say is just my assessment. DYODD"
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	Hyflux seems to be everyone's favourite example. What if I told u signs were there long before the whole saga happened? Obviously one doesn't blindly but and forget. Even for long term investment every quarter one must review. If u don't then no one to blame but yourself when things go awry. Wordee      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 12:28) Posted: hard to say lah..caution that nowadays anything can go bankrupt, rmber Hyflux? retirees sink their hard earned cpf money into Hyflux then in the end....GONE...
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Wordee Senior	11-Nov-2021 12:28        Wordee About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	hard to say lah..caution that nowadays anything can go bankrupt, rmber Hyflux? retirees sink their hard earned cpf money into Hyflux then in the end....GONE...
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bystander1965 Supreme	11-Nov-2021 12:03        bystander1965 About Contact  Quote this Post!   Mood: Yells: "What I say is just my assessment. DYODD"
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	View it another way. If you have the patience and hold it for 10 years (assuming it won' t go bankrupt, which I am quite certain will not happen), and if you get 6-7c every year, you would have gotten 60-70c back. So at today' s price, it' s 50-60c cost to you (ok I ignored the Time value of money). Anyway, the clampdown if you look carefully it is in a completely different area and different focus, IMHO.   royeko      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 11:55) Posted: No no not contra. It' s my retirement funds. Just a bit disappointed when i looked at the price chart. And most importantly, recent China political development and clampdowns really making me a bit worried. Hope moving forward really have 6~7% dividend yield.   bystander1965      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 11:15) Posted: If you are not playing contra or short term trading, there is nothing to worry about. It will go past 1.23 one day but don' t know when. In the mean just collect the div. It' s technically weak (all reits are atm). So they are all in the down cycle.
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royeko Member	11-Nov-2021 11:55        royeko About Contact  Quote this Post!
x 0   x 0  Alert Admin	No no not contra. It' s my retirement funds. Just a bit disappointed when i looked at the price chart. And most importantly, recent China political development and clampdowns really making me a bit worried. Hope moving forward really have 6~7% dividend yield.   bystander1965      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 11:15) Posted: If you are not playing contra or short term trading, there is nothing to worry about. It will go past 1.23 one day but don' t know when. In the mean just collect the div. It' s technically weak (all reits are atm). So they are all in the down cycle.   royeko      ( Date: 11-Nov-2021 10:09) Posted: My goodness.... have been averaging down and now out of bullet. Still at high average price of 1.23 Now can only suck thumb and pray that the drop will end at  S$1.165
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